Comments on: dm to Eclipse: Does it really matter?

By: Andrew C. Oliver

Andrew C. Oliver — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 19:54:12 +0000

There is a question on whether a commercial organization like JBoss or SpringSource want to host something that isn’t core to their business. IT makes sense to send those out and collaborate on them.

By: billburke

billburke — Thu, 14 Jan 2010 13:42:02 +0000

The fact that Apache.org or Eclipse.org refuses GPL, LGPL, or even ASL licensed projects is their problem, not the open source project’s. My point was that adoption bumps from licensing are orthogonal to adoption bumps from hosting at an OSS Org. For example, I’d bet you’d get a small credibility bump from being hosted at codehaus.org, but they don’t give a crap what license you use.

Again, only an insignificant amount of companies care about GPL (or LGPL) for that matter. If it was significant RHT wouldn’t be a $650+million dollar business. IMO, its the Apache blowhards that pump up this myth. In reality it just doesn’t exist.

By: Chris Aniszczyk

Chris Aniszczyk — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 23:22:21 +0000

Debate is fun ?

“License is totally orthogonal to to where the project is hosted.” ?

Oh, that’s why you see GPL projects at Apache.org and Eclipse.org? It’s not as orthogonal as you think.

Also, you have been shielded within Red Hat if you think companies don’t care about the GPL. That said, Red Hat has done very well for itself given the GPL and I commend and respect them for that.

By: Wim Jongman

Wim Jongman — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 23:05:59 +0000

Re: supposed to be impressed or something? –> No. It was a reply on your argument that resources would not magically appear (right where you said poppycock). However, ppl from Tasktop stepped in right away. You want proof? Go check the project proposal.

Re: BTW, I hope you guys don’t mind arguing –> Au contraire, I love it.

By: billburke

billburke — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 22:30:01 +0000

@Chris: License is totally orthogonal to to where the project is hosted. Plus, I think the number of users that won’t touch GPL code is very very very very small. Otherwise Linux (and other FOSS projects) wouldn’t be so popular and RHT wouldn’t have a business (a rather good business I must say).

@Wim: I did look up tasktop. I’m supposed to be impressed or something? I’m sure that most marginally successful open source projects can name at least one impressive user.

BTW, I hope you guys don’t mind arguing, but so far I don’t see a lot of proof for your statements. I can name a bunch on my end.

By: Wim Jongman

Wim Jongman — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:44:13 +0000

Re: Standardization efforts –> My point exactly, thanks for confirming

Re: Resource going to magically appear –> Did you even look at the project proposal? 20% of the contributors have magically appeared.

Re: Totally disagree –> Yeah well, congrats, most projects are not that lucky. And I suggest that you lookup Tasktop.

By: Chris Aniszczyk

Chris Aniszczyk — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 15:02:56 +0000

Bill, one big thing you missed is the license change. Going from the GPL to a weak copy-left license like the EPL is a smart move. First, it will help with adoption as there are people out there that don’t want anything to do with the GPL. Second, it will open up other companies to contribute and potentially build on the core dmServer code with their own proprietary extensions. It’s a smart move in my opinion.

Let’s see in a year how much it pays off.

Oh, Tasktop is the guys behind Mylyn
http://tasktop.com/

By: Rex Sheridan

Rex Sheridan — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 14:58:02 +0000

Because it might be perceived as Spring trying to strongarm the Eclipse community. They are obviously looking at this as a way to form a partnership (albeit mainly for show).

By: billburke

billburke — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 14:17:59 +0000

Standardization efforts need governance, IP sharing rules, etc. An OSS project cannot function efficiently within a democracy. Imagine if your governance model shut down your contributions because the governing body decided your company was dominating the project. (This happened in Geronimo).

Also, this idea that resources are going to magically appear and maintain dm Server just because it is at Eclipse is poppycock. dmServer is currently already open source. Are you saying that SpringSource doesn’t accept or try to recruit independent contributors?

And I totally disagree that you have to be MS or IBM to drive something and make it mainstream. I know because I lived it. I’m sure SpringSource feels the same. (And WTF is Tasktop anyways).

By: billburke

billburke — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 14:05:17 +0000

REx, then why not do the same with the entire Spring codebase? Bring the entire thing to Eclipse?